Burnt Hands Perspective
This is a raw and unfiltered look into the pu$$ification and state of the restaurant industry as a whole, powered by longtime friends Chef/Owner Antonio Caruana and former bartender turned News Anchor/TV Host Kristen Crowley.
Representing all aspects of the industry from the front to the back of the house we will dig into the juiciest stories and pull from decades of experience in one of the sexiest and most exciting industries in the world...the food and beverage industry.
From international chefs, sommeliers, industry pros, and so much more, this show will cover all of it without a filter. You turn up the volume; we'll turn up the heat.
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Burnt Hands Perspective
Ep 23 - Ragu & Heritage: The Italian-American Culinary Journey with first generation Italian Chefs
Imagine waking up to the irresistible aroma of ragu simmering on the stove, the promise of a leisurely Sunday feast ahead. This episode is a feast for the senses as we explore the rich tapestry of Italian-American cuisine and heritage. Joined by our special guests Andrea, Enzo, and Sebastiano, we unravel the intricate dance between authentic Italian fare and its Italian-American counterpart. Enzo's recent achievement of American citizenship adds a heartfelt layer to our conversation, as we reflect on how our shared love for Italian culture has influenced our lives and shaped our culinary journeys.
As we navigate the cultural crossroads of Italian and American cuisines, we uncover the unique regional influences that have created beloved dishes like gabagool, mortadella, and pasta fazool. From the French and Austrian touches in Northern Italy to the vibrant North African flavors in the South, each region's identity contributes to the diversity of Italian-American cuisine. Our stories reveal how Italian immigrants adapted their beloved recipes to new lands, leading to cherished creations such as chicken parmesan and Fettuccine Alfredo. We even pay homage to New Haven, Connecticut, as a beacon of exceptional pizza, celebrating the blend of tradition and adaptation that defines this culinary fusion.
Throughout our conversation, we tackle cultural stereotypes, discussing the evolution of the Italian-American identity and its impact on language and cuisine. We passionately express concerns about preserving authentic Italian cooking in an ever-evolving culinary world, emphasizing the importance of homemade, quality foods. Running an Italian restaurant has its fiery moments, and we share our experiences of maintaining culinary integrity amidst critiques and stereotypes. As we wrap up, we toast to our audience's enthusiasm and look forward to continuing this vibrant dialogue in future episodes. Ciao for now!
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Okay, listen to this. The Italian movement is real. Here it is. We got the Italian connection. Matter of fact, we're all first generation in a sense, and fucking even more so, right?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So here's what we hear. This episode's gonna be fun because you guys are full-on Italian heritage, all cooked together. We've all cooked together here. You all work greatly underneath in my kitchen and it's fucking amazing. So we have a long history. But first of all, we're going to talk about a couple things today.
Speaker 2:What are we?
Speaker 1:going to talk about. We're going to talk about the Italian-American fucking food versus Italy's food and the misconception. Right, and that's the biggest thing. We're going to talk about the Italian language in American. Where did it come from? How? Meaning marone gabagool fucking mortadella galamad right.
Speaker 3:What else Pasta di?
Speaker 1:mar, pasta di mar. What else? Ganoules, ganoules, bostechok. Yeah, you know the svoyedel.
Speaker 3:Svoyedel Prejute.
Speaker 1:What else? Pasta fazool, pasta fazool, pasta fazool.
Speaker 4:That's a big one.
Speaker 1:So these are the things we're going to talk about and kind of where they come from right.
Speaker 2:Mariner, mariner, mariner.
Speaker 1:And the spaghetti, everything's spaghetti, spaghetti, spaghetti, everything's spaghetti. Pasta, rigatoni with sauce, spaghetti, gravy, gravy and what the fuck is the gravy right? So this is what we're going to talk about. This is going to be fun.
Speaker 1:This is going to be a learning experience for me, so I want you guys to introduce yourself real quick, and I'm going to show you how diverse we are. But yet we are from the same fucking place in a sense, because all of our fucking family is from the same boot, so it's not like we're generations removed. Here we have direct lineage, and Enzo here in the middle literally became an American citizen yesterday, for became an American citizen yesterday.
Speaker 1:Cheers For real Congratulations. You were studying that. You were proud of that. I remember how, watching him getting excited and nervous about it, right, and my father got his you know, they went and got it. It's got to be nerve-wracking because it's a whole new culture. It would be like me going to Italy. Even though I've gone there since I was young and I go there often more as an adult, you still have to learn. You don't learn that shit. I can go to Italy 100 times a year. And what are you focusing on? The historical balance of Italy, right, we're not looking at who the president is. We don't do that when we go to Italy. When you come to America, you're not looking at what a senator does and the preamble.
Speaker 1:You're not looking for it. So when you come here, you have to learn something you've never even expected. So congratulations, bro. That's amazing. So, with that being said, we're going to tear this shit up because we have some stuff to say. You're going to probably do a lot of smiling.
Speaker 2:So I'm just going to sit back, because this is like the tables are turned. Now we have like all men and I just get to sit back and watch.
Speaker 1:Italian guys talk and I'm only a quarter.
Speaker 2:My family is from Italy as well, but I'm two generations removed.
Speaker 1:But your palate says it all.
Speaker 2:You speak with the Italian tongue when you eat and everything else.
Speaker 1:And your mouth. You like that too, so it works. With that mouth You're right in there With that mouth dude, with that mouth dude. So, andrea, go ahead and introduce yourself where you come real quick from, and then we'll go down the line.
Speaker 4:So I'm Andrea DiCarlo, originally from Brooklyn, new York, moved to Virginia in 1988. We opened up a family restaurant, cooked in it. Me and Tony cooked for a long time, became good, good friends. Um, that's about it. I spent all my summers in italy, every summer, until I was about 13. So, speaking fluently, um, love food, love the culture. I mean, it's embedded in me, so it's the only culture that's the only love.
Speaker 1:Something else would be loving something else exactly. We are who, we are right, right, exactly, go ahead.
Speaker 5:Enzo, I'm Vincenzo Di Vano and I come here 10 years ago and I love this place, I love being in America. It was my dream and finally, yesterday I got all my documents. And, to be good, to continue this.
Speaker 1:So you're on it. So Enzo's the guy that comes into town fucking Mr Italy, all sexy with his long hair and his abs and his six-packs and his mom American dream. Everybody American dream. Yeah, you know, he's just a Vespa short of the actual fucking story. We need to get you a Vespa bro.
Speaker 2:Yeah, or did you get?
Speaker 4:me a Vespa, a Vespa, a Vespa, get you a scooter just for here in Summit Point, it's okay.
Speaker 1:Yeah, right here, just right around.
Speaker 3:Sal? What about yourself? My name is Sebastiano Ganci. I was born here in Northern Virginia. I'm first generation Sicilian. I've been doing restaurants. That's just what I love to do. I've been working for you for a while.
Speaker 1:Pizza's your game Pizza yeah, so your family's in the pizza game Pretty much everything.
Speaker 3:We started out with the pizza.
Speaker 1:Of course, the Sicilian pizza connection. We all know what this is. We all know what's going on around here. It's in my blood.
Speaker 3:I love to cook.
Speaker 1:So now your game is pasta now. Now you're strong on the pasta. So Seb makes all. He's in charge of our pasta program, making all the fresh pastas, the homemade pastas, the actual pasta. Enzo steps in when he's off, so on down the line, the last person who wants to touch it anymore is me. So hopefully you guys' team stays strong, but if I have to get in there again, I will. But however, of course, everybody knows me. I'm chef antonio caruana. This is our burnt hands perspective podcast with kristin crawley, and we're about to get into some fun shit right now about this. Uh, everybody knows and follows me as a chef. My accolades are out there. Just google my name and figure it out and, uh, I appreciate all the support going into this. So what do you want to talk about? First, andre, this is what I want to talk about. Let me hear what you want want to talk about Go ahead.
Speaker 4:I mean, there's so much. There's so much to talk about. Coming into the podcast, I was thinking about sitting next to Enzo he's from Naples and I'm from me, and Seba from Sicily. How, in any other part of Italy besides Naples and Sicily, if you ask them, they say Italian, I'm from Italy. But if you ask someone from Sicily or from Naples, we're not Italian, I'm Sicilian and he's from Naples.
Speaker 1:So it's almost like a sub-color. My father would say Roma.
Speaker 5:It's different. It's different. South to north is very different.
Speaker 1:Sure, of course. So the further north you go, you're getting a lot more of that Deutschland, german, austrian, french. Even If you're going up towards Piemonte, in Milano, that has got a lot more French influence because you're bordering the French colonies up there and a lot of the food and the influence comes together. So you have that corridor where you can go to Nice, france, and experience some really good, if not the best, italian food, whereas if you go up towards Piemonte, you get a lot of france, uh, france infusion and influence. Yeah right, if you go towards the other side, you're going to get a lot of the austrian influence. When you're up top right, you move down towards the middle. To me I don't say it's middle, it's more south. But when you go into napoli and roma and stuff like that, you're going to get the pure italian, where you get a little bit of the south. You start creeping up into the middle and now it just becomes italian. Where the kingdoms were before italy was a country yeah am I right?
Speaker 1:you can correct this better than me. I'm trying to go from an italian citizenship over here. Okay, okay, so, so that that's what it is. So when you go to napoli, roma, you're going to get a much more true experience. Now, when you get down towards Calabria, in the southern part of the boot of Italy, you're going to get some of that Tunisian, northern African type of influence, starting to touch the food, which we know consists of what? Pepper, spice. You know what I mean. Brightness, sunshine, almonds and nuts, almonds, nuts, all those things.
Speaker 3:Chickpeas stuff like that.
Speaker 1:What is it, bro? Chickpeas, chickpeas. Yeah right, exactly the saffron, All that stuff. That's kind of influenced from the south. So just as you go to the south of Italy getting influenced from that part of the world, you go to the north and get influenced from that part of the world, making it the fucking best food to Okay. And what most people don't understand is when we go out, you know, people go out for Italian food. So people ask me what's your, is Italian food, your favorite food? Listen, it doesn't work that way. Chinese people don't go out for Chinese, they go out to eat. They eat, right. So at home they'll. Oh, I bet you eat Italian food all the time. Yeah, call it what you want, but pasta is pasta. It's it'sian food, by your judgment, because you don't eat it all the time. Yeah, so they go out for italian food, right, we just eat right we just eat.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we go out for vietnamese food, we go out for american food, we go out for cheeseburgers uh, we go out for all that stuff. Right, to us it's not italian food, it's food, right. Everyone else coming to this restaurant is coming for Italian food, because we're producing the food that we eat.
Speaker 2:And you do it differently here.
Speaker 1:And we do it differently. So here, what we try and do and this is where I want to touch base with you guys, because you all have a different background in cooking and your experience with food, right. So my touch on things is I travel around Italy, I'm inspired by the different regions, right, and I get inspired to try and stick to those regions and the rules of them best I can, while trying to satisfy the knowledge of the American people. So let's get into the subject. This is the fun one Italian-American food. Italian-american food.
Speaker 2:It already starts laughing Now the Italians that come here. It's despicable you think it's disgusting, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1:It's no good right, Mushad, everything's junk. So you have that. That's the Italian version of this right. So, and there's understandable why, Understandable why so, when we're calling it gabagool and it's not even close, say it.
Speaker 5:Capicolo.
Speaker 1:Capicolo Prosciutto, prosciutto, parmigiano-reggiano, these are things. Where's the parmesan?
Speaker 5:Parmesan.
Speaker 1:Parmesan, you know, I understand. They don't understand the language, they don't get it. I get the it deviates from the original core right when it came from. So we have things like mortadella, right. Mortadella goes back centuries, centuries, right, long time ago, in that one little area, that one kingdom, typically in belonging to Italy, where it comes from, am I wrong?
Speaker 5:No, you're right.
Speaker 1:Okay, so let's fast forward now. Oscar Meyer, 1978, 1970, 1985, 1985, when I'm a kid, in a yellow packet comes out and it says bologna, and people are calling it bologna, bologna, and then it calls bologna. See how the transition goes. We're going from mortadella. People came here from america. They didn't have the ingredients. So the italians that came here from bologna wanted their mortadella right, yeah, they couldn't produce the mortadella properly because they didn't have the ingredients. So the italians that came here from bologna wanted their mortadella right, yeah, they couldn't produce the mortadella properly because they didn't have the same indigenous ingredients.
Speaker 1:If you're living in new york city back in the 1800s or early 1900s, where are you going to get the product to make mortadella? The fat, the pistachio, all that stuff? Where are you going to get it? Right, you can't. So they made the closest thing to it and they call it was called bologna because it was the way of bologna, the way of mortadella. So then along came the way of bologna, and then they changed it and americanized it. Now bologna comes from mortadella, which comes from bologna, which is now bologna, bologna. So see the transition here. So a lot of people don't understand where italian american food got its history and why it is what it is right. People say fettuccine Alfredo, they want this. People do what you're doing, but let's think about it. It's not that bad for an American, because it's what they're used to. That's their palate yeah.
Speaker 1:What they tried to do at Alfredo's restaurant is it happened by accident, the history of it came along and it was really pleasing to the palate, no different than Cacio Pepe, right? So Cacio Pepe, beautiful cheese, delicious. Two different versions Parmigiano-Reggiano, pecorino, romano, pepper technique. Okay, well, you can have the same technique, but you don't have the same ingredients. Back in 1965 or whenever it was Alfredo, it was expensive, it was expensive, it was hard to get. So what do they do? They take the cheese that they have. You can't get the extracted cream because it's not that type of cheese. It's close but it's not. So you have to add maybe a little bit of cream to make it like this.
Speaker 1:This is how, trying to copy what they're used to cacio e pepe, they've invented fettuccine alfredo because it wasn't the best, but they had to have something close. American people ate it because they've never had cacio pepe and it's still good. But it's not cacio pepe, right, it's not. So where does it? So when people say I want fettuccine alfredo, I understand it, I get it, but I also understand where it came from, so I can respect it differently. You know what I mean. Yeah, so a lot of people don't understand that Chicken parmesan. There's no chicken parmesan, bro. You go to Rome right now. Is there chicken parmesan in Rome?
Speaker 5:No, or in Napoli it doesn't exist in Italy.
Speaker 1:It doesn't exist, no.
Speaker 5:Chicken, parm, all this kind of food, american, italian food doesn't exist.
Speaker 1:So when you come here, it's a culture shock for you. Ten years ago you came here 10 years ago and I got in one restaurant.
Speaker 5:They used to do this kind of American Italian. I was like I'll read the menu Fettuccine Alfredo. What's Fettuccine Alfredo? I don't know.
Speaker 1:Who the hell is.
Speaker 5:Alfredo, I don't know how to make it. Take a little bit of butter and put this.
Speaker 1:And then they put the nutmeg sometimes.
Speaker 2:They were right. What is this?
Speaker 5:I'm sorry, I don't know.
Speaker 1:And then, when you taste it, you're expecting cacio e pepe. You're getting this watered down version. Yeah, creamy, thick, heavy, rich.
Speaker 1:Three bites One dimensional, but to people who've never had the real cacio e pepe fettuccine, alfredo is the second best thing and they love it. So that that's how this happens. So the difference between Italian American food, even going back to pizza, you don't even going back to pizza. So yeah, pizza. You have a Napoli pizza. This goes back a long time in history, right, and even in Italy they have different variations of pizza. There are some places in America I feel I won't brag. New Haven, connecticut, where I'm from, has better pizza than anything I've had in Italy. And I travel the world and I eat, I'm a chef, I do it, I've gone to Italy very many times and more times to count, and I still haven't found a pizza better than that.
Speaker 1:So is it because I'm from there and that's my origin? Is that where I started? It goes backwards the same way. So Italians come here and they're so stuck on what they know because it's where they started. Do I think New Haven pizza is the best because that's where I started and I'm trying to run a nostalgia?
Speaker 3:My nonna. When she used to come here she used to say New York style pizza. She loved it. She loved it better than back home. She was in love with it too, new York style is kind of like a Romana pizza.
Speaker 5:It's more thin, more crunchy at the bottom. The big slice, the crust is not too fluffy, yeah, so that's why you know I like it too, though.
Speaker 1:I'm not going to lie. Yeah, of course it is good. It is good, but it has its place. But you're from Napoli, bro.
Speaker 5:Pizza Napoletana.
Speaker 1:There's nothing. You're never going to convince you different, bro. Forget it. Fuck out of here.
Speaker 5:Get the fuck out of here with this shit. Yeah, yeah, it's good.
Speaker 1:So now, when I went to Napoli, want pizza anywhere else because I was used to it a certain way, a style right. The first time I went to Naples I had a pizza and it came to my table, and right away and this is years ago, a long time, I'm young right away, I look at this thing.
Speaker 2:Sorry, you don't have to laugh at that.
Speaker 1:You know, you know that hurt.
Speaker 2:I'm sorry.
Speaker 1:So I had this pizza and, yeah, it was so long ago. It was probably back in the old days when they were actually making pizza, Making fire you know, with sticks.
Speaker 1:So this came to my table and I'm not gonna lie, I looked at it and I poked it like a, like a fucking baby. I'm like what the hell is going on. It looked like a pastry. You know what I on? It looked like a pastry. You know what I mean. It looked like a pastry. It didn't look like a pizza to me and it wasn't cut or anything. And I'm like what am I going to do? They don't cut it. No, they don't cut it, so I just take out, rip it. All the mozzarella falls off, its sauce is all dripping everywhere. And I'm trying to get my Pellegrino, I'm pounding it, I'm trying to get through this situation. And at the beginning I didn't like it. It took me a long time to like it. Now I like it because I understand it. I'm cultured now. I wasn't as cultured back then and now it was just one way.
Speaker 2:Well, you're used to what you're used to.
Speaker 1:Right. So now I get it, and that's what happened to me is I ate that big dough ball and it was just soggy. It just wasn't what I was used to, right. But the tomatoes, the cheese and the basil, it was outstanding. So what did I do? I brought my punk ass here back then. Years went by and I started trying to create a dough that like the New Haven style or a New York style with that style of sauce, and there's now a few people doing it and it works well for me. But I think that Napoli dough is. I'm still not used to that. It's so filling one slice. You know what I mean. The temperature they cook it.
Speaker 4:So hot, that it's like the dough puffs up and the toppings barely just get hot. And that's really the beauty of it, is the honoring the ingredients on there without like overheating or overcooking them. Okay, that's what I think too about it is.
Speaker 1:There's a, there's a technique, and a lot of it has to do with the heat of your oven, and if that heat of the oven is off, this ab, tell me about this absolutely come out like shit comes out, like shit your yeast. It doesn't rise, right, it doesn't. You're gonna burn the outside because it's too much. Oil is burning fast, burning fast.
Speaker 3:It's gonna be all weird like a cracker. Yeah right, there's all types of stuff.
Speaker 1:So you have in New Haven. There's a few places that have been doing it since the 20s, 1920s, and the ovens are still running the same way. So the consistency is the same every single time, and that's the same way as it is in Naples. I'm sure you know what I mean. You go to and they have in a certain places you go in, like here. There's certain places you don't go, even as a local. Right, there's still shit there too.
Speaker 2:There's still bad food. Yeah, I mean, do you think there's bad food in certain areas?
Speaker 5:yeah, yeah, you know someplace, then they just do it because. But they don't, because they don't try to. Um, I used to know, Upgrade update, yeah, update modern.
Speaker 1:Modernizing me like they want to leave it like that yeah right, but the traditions change and people as they grow, they experience more in the world and in their palates open up more and they want, yeah, and they experience more.
Speaker 1:Try new things now it right, and I think what happened here in america with italian food, italian american food, is it got so bastardized because people were making so much money off of it, because you can put a mediocre time out there and it'd be okay. Olive garden, just put right, just put cheese cream and some ham with a, with a tortellini that's been frozen for seven months yeah, you know what I, what I mean?
Speaker 2:People don't care.
Speaker 1:It comes out of the bag and half of it's white from the freezer, burn and they eat it because it's still going to be acceptable. Yeah, and it's still for people who don't go out and eat it at all. There's still a lot of flavor in those components. Those ingredients just release things in your taste buds. It's simple, Simple math.
Speaker 2:And they add more salt and they add things to make you keep eating it. Yeah, Right. That's the American sad diet yeah.
Speaker 1:So I'm going to go down the line here. Growing up, you're going to see different things and there's something that happened.
Speaker 4:Typical Sunday meal at your house Pasta Forno, which is like little ring pastas with a boneless ragu peas, and you bake it like a lasagna uh, spadini veal, uh, wrapped, skewered with the uh uh arica provolone inside and grilled awesome um, those are good.
Speaker 1:So the spadini is like a spare, that's what. So it's the stick almost like a skewer yeah, like a skewer, you roll the veal stuff.
Speaker 4:It's fucking amazing bay leaves and you grill it. And then, uh, for us. You know we own bakeries, so for us, cassata, siciliana and cannolis, literally on the table.
Speaker 1:I'm going to have a cassata coffin for you when I die. You're going to be laying inside of it.
Speaker 4:Cassata, cassata, coffin yeah.
Speaker 3:If there's a tablecloth on the table, he's like nice.
Speaker 4:If there's a tablecloth on the table, there's a cassata and semolina bread. If there's not those two things, someone's walking to the store because dinner doesn't start to those two things at the table. That's pretty much what it was Meatballs like the ragu people call the ragu with the meatballs and the um sausage. We used to put pig's feet in it. Um, we did that occasionally but for us it was weird because, being first generation, like cutlets and chicken parm, my family in italy doesn't eat it, yeah, but all my family here in new york, including my uncles at all first generation cutlets on the table.
Speaker 4:It's almost like a given. It has to be there for like sentimental reasons. So I think that has to do a lot with when everyone immigrated here. You know availability of ingredients, portability. You know for people that work in the coal mines of the factories, they want something that they can just put on a piece of bread and eat it, and I think part of it came from that. But we do it. But like we go to Italy, no cutlets on my aunt's table, nothing. But when you go to Brooklyn, to my uncle's house, there's always cutlets and that comes along in an Italian-American deal.
Speaker 1:So we had the same thing and I used to love going through my aunt's house and it'd be the middle of the afternoon There'd be a plate of chicken cutlets with saran wrap over the top and they were room temperature. You just walk by, break a piece, put some lemonade and walk by, but that smell of the breadcrumb would sit and you'd have the little TV on in the kitchen and you would always smell. You would smell the salt in the pasta water. It resonates, and it was such a small period of my life because I was only a kid for this long. You know what I mean. We were kids for this long and what happened to us resonates the rest of our life, as we know, good, bad or indifferent, no matter what it is. But when it comes to Italian people, I can speak for myself that if you're this long of your life, this chapter as being a kid is this long compared to the 50 years I've been alive. What seven or eight of them when I didn't understand what it was, but it made me who I am now. The smells, the vibrance, just the energy of it, the listening to the memory. There's something to be said. When you take the sauce and you have the sauce and you put the ravioli on the table in a bowl, you smell the ricotta inside the pasta. You can smell this.
Speaker 1:I could walk in your house and know what you're cooking now or what you're, what you're knowing now your, your mom or anybody's cooking I'm making, because I can smell it when I'm walking in door. Yeah, oh, that's oh, they got, they got. They got sausage and broccoli ravioli. You fucking shit me. You walk down the street in Brooklyn or any little Italy area and you can smell what they're cooking inside. You know what I mean. You want to go in there and do a house. What do you call it? A home invasion?
Speaker 1:on that ass breaking and entering yeah so what about you on a Sunday at home growing?
Speaker 5:up Sunday Naples, Naples. It's like crazy because it's like you got to every Sunday meal. You got to sacrifice yourself Because it's a lot of food. You start with prosciutto mozzarella, you start smelling the ragu, then Mom make. When you wake up in the morning, you smell it With the bread Before you start eating, you go with the bread and the sauce. Yeah, of course you start eating all the.
Speaker 1:They smack your hand.
Speaker 3:Stop it, don't eat it.
Speaker 5:Prosciutto mozzarella gnocchi in the oven baked with mozzarella. Nice mozzarella from Naples. Of course Buffalo Buffalo yeah, salsiccia friarielli, prosciutto tracchulelle, cotica di maiale, that's all in the ragu. Come on, man. And salsiccia frielli, parmigiana, a lot of food like dessert, fruit, everything Like you start, like at 2 pm, you finish around 7.
Speaker 2:Every Sunday. Every Sunday Wow.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah, and that's the best.
Speaker 5:And then by 9 o'clock, you start all over again, yeah, and you start eating all the leftovers.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah, so but that's exactly how it is. When you could smell when they're browning the meat inside the pan, you're not even out of bed yet and you know you could smell the browning meat, the sausage and the oil before the tomatoes even hit inside and you know right away what time it is and you already know it's going to be a good day. You know what I mean. It's going to be a good day today. What about you, Saab? What happens?
Speaker 3:over there. It was the best you know. That was our alarm clock. Wake up smelling tomato, basil in the air and all the pasta, the chicken cutlets too. We're the same way. Pasta al forno. On the left of the rings, we use rigatoni.
Speaker 1:Sure.
Speaker 3:So ours is a little bit more. You know this is different. It's both still good, but the pasta al forno is.
Speaker 1:We all know. No matter what pasta you use, it's the same basic principle. You can either do it with a ground meat type of ragu or Bolognese style of sauce, or you can do lamb beef.
Speaker 3:Yeah. And then some people put eggs, whatever eggs, beef, yeah. And then some people put eggs whatever it is. I love it.
Speaker 1:Pasta al forno is a thing that's gone away. It needs to come back. Can we bring it back or what? Can people stop fucking around and get back to the pasta al forno, please?
Speaker 2:You know what I mean. Instead of the gravy.
Speaker 1:I know that's what I'm saying. We have a habit of making things ridiculously good, right, and it ends up helping the customer here because we do it. I do it just to try and impress them. Every time I test something, I give it to them to try this, and it's not because I'm trying to get approval, it's because I already fucking know it's good and I want you to feel this Taste. This man, this is good. I want you to be happy.
Speaker 2:Eat this, because I know it's going to put you in the same spot it put me. I'm not trying to impress nobody. I've already done that. I can do that, you know I already know that.
Speaker 1:I know I can cook, so I'm not worried about that. But I want you to feel this, feel something. You can hit somebody else and be like. You know, if you give it to an american person who does doesn't have that background, they'll eat it and be like oh, that's good chef. Yeah, would you put in that?
Speaker 2:yeah, they don't know, would you put?
Speaker 1:that you should be eating it going. Oh, shit, shit, I take it. You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:But also the culture. When you said, like the culture shock for you guys coming here because you're newer, like you've been here the least amount of time of everybody, the difference in cooking and men. So in Italy, like in the culture, men cook, you learn to cook, it's part of the culture, the passion and people feel that here in the Us we don't have that. Most men don't cook. So I mean, how shocking was that to you, like when, like getting used to that, coming here and women being like oh, you can cook, like it's surprising I don't know it was.
Speaker 5:It was a good feeling because you know you gonna show what you got and you bring all your culture here and you know you try your best to make a good food yeah and let them taste it so I want to know this how I travel the world and there's no food better.
Speaker 1:I don't understand how much food culture is in that peninsula. Basically yeah you know, I mean the, the country of italy is that big, but if you look at it, when it comes to food, luxury, craftsmanship, everything that comes out of that little peninsula right there, concentrated in there, it's so much in there. The flavors, the indigenous flavors, truffle, truffle di alba, tartufa di bionda, the white truffle, how is it? Only right there.
Speaker 1:The tree is a popular tree. This is the name of the tree that grows popular and they grow everywhere. They're in Maine, they're in here, they're in the woods over here, it's everywhere. But it only grows at the base of those trees in that area. How is this possible? It's the Mecca of all things. Good yeah, like to make a Parmesan Reggiano wheel. You know the 18 months, 24 months. If you go into those factories where they're just lined up head to ceiling, like this, and you're walking down there, people don't realize how good yeah, you're walking down the hall. If you're walking through them, it's like the Red Seas, like Moses, you're on biblical level.
Speaker 2:Biblical cheese.
Speaker 1:You're in the Bible now. Yeah, it's like that. You know what I mean. So did you ever wonder that, like when you come here, you go to north carolina, people love the barbecue? I understand, I get it. You took the pig, you did what you did because you grew up on that and it's good. But in retrospect or comparison, they're missing so much of this barbecue process that could really make this thing crazy good, yeah, yeah but if I make that for them, they're like it's good, but it ain't like this.
Speaker 1:And I'm not doubting them. It's just how different regions react to food and how Italy and Italians react to food. To me, the only other place I can see it two other places I can see it is Thailand, because they are all about food there too.
Speaker 2:They have a great food scene. Food is amazing.
Speaker 1:And there's other countries out there, don't get me wrong. There's so many good countries.
Speaker 2:I'm going to get Greece. I mean, there's a lot of great culture, food Thailand.
Speaker 1:Thailand is good, If you ever eat Thailand they do have Now you got to go. Their ingredients are ridiculous they have the connection of food like we do. It's a lot of indigenous ingredients from the ground or from the animal Very organic. Very organic and it's very fresh, very floral, very vibrant. Spices, noodles, yeah, and that just could be because it reminds me of Italian food in the way, the flavors are just crazy.
Speaker 2:It is simple, but it's good.
Speaker 1:And it's on the opposite way of we eat Same type of stuff they got the noodles, but it's good. And it's on the opposite way of we eat Same type of stuff they got the noodles, but they cook it with such different flavors that it's a whole new world with the same type of experience. So if you go to that, that's amazing. You just said Greece. Believe it or not? Fellas, we got some bad news here. This year is the first year Greece beat Italy as the number one food country, Really this year by one half of a point on the judges' spectrum.
Speaker 2:Half of a point. Half of a point, okay 5.9 to 6.
Speaker 1:And I can't remember what scale it was, but it's a big one that I followed for years as a chef, okay, and for the first time. But now I go to Greece, yeah, much as I can. I love Greece and they have some phenomenal food, but we share the same waters, the same fish the same thing.
Speaker 1:So I'm not. You know they do have some stuff that we don't. That is good. If you get some good feta cheese, all that stuff, I mean, they do put together some really good things that are amazing Octopus, octopus. We're running that same thing. And if you go even further, you go to Spain. They also have some good food. The only thing I find with Spain is a lot of the ingredients are kind of meshing the same and they all have that same. I can check Spanish food right now from Spain. You know what I mean Spanish food. I can smell it and I know exactly what it is, where it is, how it is and it's delicious. Don't get me wrong, I love it. You know their versions of their r is in the paellas and all that stuff is amazing. But I think that Italian food and Italian American food is some of the best food on the planet. That's all I'm going to fucking say.
Speaker 2:I think most people. If you ask them what their favorite foods are in the world, I think always in the top three. Like, for anybody doesn't matter where they live, what country, if you don't like Italian food.
Speaker 1:I don't trust you.
Speaker 3:No, I don't trust you. No, I don't trust you. I can't trust you If you don't like.
Speaker 1:Italian food. I can't trust you.
Speaker 3:You're wearing a wire. Get the fuck away Me personally, I only eat Italian.
Speaker 5:That's it when I go out. If I don't eat Italian, I eat a cheeseburger.
Speaker 3:Yeah right, that's it. I don't go out for a time. I don't go Chinese, I don't go Vietnamese. There's no point really.
Speaker 1:My problem is I have a hard time going out. Now I'll go to a nice steakhouse, a Thai restaurant, during the lunch.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:But I have a hard time going out, because no matter what, even if I'm going to a restaurant at the beach, I still want at the pasta and I still trying to look up to see if they have any type of pasta. Yeah, if not, I'll get a pizza whatever, and I still want. I still want that it's because I don't feel complete unless I'm eating that way. I want pasta on my plate, yeah, and I don't care what time it is I want it now?
Speaker 1:yeah, he knows what he's talking about, I know so. So what about now? What about these guys that are taking the italian? I'm watching these guys and I'm following social media. They fucking make me laugh because they're all doing it right, because they're exactly doing what we did and we still do, but we do it jokingly and they're totally doing it jokingly. You know, I'm talking about these. Take care, brush your hair and and uh, hey, mo, and and what else is the other guys?
Speaker 1:uh, I can't remember yeah those guys, but they're all good guys, they're funny and they really hit home with all this shit. But as an italian, do you understand what's going on when they're doing this, or do you find it like mockery? Like, uh like insulting or is it a joke, because we know what they're?
Speaker 4:doing because we yeah yeah, um or is it funny to you?
Speaker 5:yeah, it's funny, but you know, sometimes I got offended really yeah, yeah why though? Because they make a joke, they make a fun of us yeah, they're getting, they're getting. That's the funny thing you're making money. Real. You know, like I don't know like I feel like offended a little bit, I don't. Here's the thing thing that they're making money. That's the real. You know, like I don't know, Like I feel like offended a little bit, I don't here's the thing, though I don't believe that they're making fun of Italian people.
Speaker 1:They're making fun of the Italian wannabe people, the fugazi and the forget about it, and all that shit that's so stereotypical. You know what I mean?
Speaker 4:The movies Forget about you know what I mean. Forget about get a bar like the old school mob movies.
Speaker 1:Everyone thinks that that's the way everything is, and it's not, man. I you know what it's it. But it's funny though, because it's we talk that way still, yeah I asked the other day. You know we laugh at it. The gabagool give me a pass, yeah, pass right, no, never, never murder.
Speaker 4:So it's, it's but it's.
Speaker 1:It's funny, though, because when you're walking through the streets and you're in Brooklyn, for instance, that's where a lot of this stuff comes from. Yeah, and the gravy? You know, believe it or not, gravy comes from Providence. That term literally comes from Providence.
Speaker 5:Rhode Island is where that started at federal people Think that a gravy is a sauce not American people, it a certain few.
Speaker 1:I never thought of it but in Providence, raleigh is where it came from, and then I think it worked its way to New Jersey.
Speaker 5:Isn't that some gravy?
Speaker 1:Yeah. It's not a sauce, I think it's a sauce, I would say, I think it's a sauce, because I grew up in Midwest in Michigan, detroit. So they called tomato sauce gravy then.
Speaker 2:No, we called gravy gravy.
Speaker 1:Tomato sauce was spaghetti. You put gravy on turkey, right Tomato sauce was spaghetti.
Speaker 2:That's all we had. We had spaghetti with red sauce on it. That was just called spaghetti. There was no different. I never learned sauces until I moved to Virginia.
Speaker 1:So right, that's exactly where I started, so you're from the Midwest.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:Where there's no Italian culture.
Speaker 2:I had no difference between marinara pomodoro nothing.
Speaker 5:General sauce, yeah, red sauce.
Speaker 2:I'm the only person with an Italian grandmother who did not cook. She was the worst cook on the planet. What I mean? Bad. It was so bad we had to eat. Holidays was the only she would put the jello with the pistachio. It was terrible. Everything was terrible. God rest her soul.
Speaker 4:She was a terrible cook.
Speaker 2:Everything was well done burnt. It was terrible. Where was?
Speaker 4:she from in.
Speaker 2:Italy. My great-grandfather was from Palermo.
Speaker 1:No offense, yeah, I know.
Speaker 2:Just saying I'm so sorry, I'm so sorry to everyone in Italian culture. I had the one grandfather who could not cook. Bro listen, but when?
Speaker 1:I go to Italy. There's plenty of people. There are people too, there are humans too, and it doesn't mean just because you're.
Speaker 2:Italian. You know how to fucking cook.
Speaker 1:There's people there burning water trying to make pasta it's the same thing, it's just there's less sucky people at cooking there.
Speaker 2:So I never learned anything Like. No, my great-grandmother never spoke Italian, nothing. They were very American.
Speaker 1:Here's what scares me about the Italian heritage in cooking. It is really becoming an issue, because when we were growing up whether you're in Italy, new Haven, brooklyn, it doesn't matter there was Italian immigrants and their young would take on and do it. So there'd be no problem walking through an Italian street and you smell the bakery. You go inside, you get the loaf of bread, you break it. You have a choice between your sourdough, your country, your Tuscon or your fucking that semolina Bread, whatever it may be, and you could break off that eat. It is delicious, if fucking. Now you can't do that anymore. And it's not because people don't want it. It's because the younger generations of Italians, the, the fifth and sixth generations, could give a shit less. They don't want it until they get about 30 years old, and then they want it again. But now it's too late because the craft is gone. Now you have to go to the grocery store, the big package grocery store, and get that crap that they put there, and you're just sitting there again chewing the fucking Naples dough.
Speaker 2:It's okay, it's okay.
Speaker 3:He's about to have an aneurysm.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm about to get shot, he's gonna throw something he'll put in his two week notice.
Speaker 3:This is bullshit he's about to give up his citizenship? No, but you know what I?
Speaker 2:mean, I love Napoli pizza don't get me wrong, but it's just a joke.
Speaker 1:However, when you eat that fucking stuff.
Speaker 2:I wanna go, I wanna try we're all going my point is though I want to try.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, we got to go, we're going, we're all going, we're all going, we're not going to go.
Speaker 2:Well, yeah, I know.
Speaker 1:But my point is, though, is the craft is gone. I'm trying and I'm no longer spring, I'm not young anymore. I still think I'm young. I still think I'm a younger generation trying to keep it going. Yeah, but I'm 50 years old man, I'm still thinking I'm a young generation. I'm the guy that needs to be replaced soon, but I'm worried about who the hell is going to replace me, because the window is closing, man, it's closing, and it scares me that people are going to buy frozen meatballs and not learning how to make their own. If it's meatballs is your style, now we know in Italy, meatballs isn't a big thing. It's more of an appetizer. You cook it in a sauce, give your sauce flavor, and then you eat the meatball by itself. Ricotta cheese, maybe some bread as a snack, or something at lunch.
Speaker 1:But the spaghetti and meatball thing, that's another American-Italian thing, it's an adaptation. It's an adaptation and be honest with you.
Speaker 2:We're just going to do his face. We're going to do your face, like every time when it's made right, it's not a bad deal. No, when it's made right, it's not a bad deal.
Speaker 1:I'd rather have a great bowl of spaghetti and meatballs than a great steak. You know, what I mean If I had a really good spaghetti and meatballs I'm talking about a good one and a really good steak. I would rather have spaghetti and meatballs.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Do you?
Speaker 2:have the review.
Speaker 1:I do.
Speaker 2:Okay, should we hit it. So we need to hit so we always do at the end of these a bad review, like someone who left a bad comment online. So he's going to read it and we're going to let you you can go off on them in Italian, because they won't know what you're saying so curse them out in Italian yeah, yeah, it's your moment. It's your moment, it's your moment, sunshine, you're the purebred.
Speaker 1:You're the purebred. The fuckery amongst us all is real and we talk some shit and we have some fun and we cook some great food and we say my own. We don't say mamma mia, do we?
Speaker 4:Mamma mia Sometimes, sometimes. Yeah. So I'm going to read this review. We don't say mama mia, do we?
Speaker 1:mama mia sometimes, sometimes yeah, yeah, get into it. So I'm gonna read this review. At the end of every episode, we used to read the reviews and then we got so intense, sometimes with conversations that are time, so now we're bringing it back it's coming back so italian job what it is is this we work our asses off, we're in the kitchen, we're producing our culture's food, and none us here, none of us, would let something slide because it's not acceptable.
Speaker 1:We wouldn't accept it. It just doesn't happen If something's not broken, broken sauce, too much cheese. If something has to change, we change it, we don't let it go out. So I know that part of it's covered, right. So I like to just attack and here's one of my favorite ones, because this is one of my biggest pet peeves and I'll explain it why. Ready, I got to thank Miss Nikki over here.
Speaker 1:Nikki went and got our as usual behind the scenes over there keeping it going. I believe the restaurant is overrated. As a New Yorker, I'm familiar with high quality food and service, so my husband and I were eager to try this place after relocating. We arrived without reservations on a Friday night around 6 45 PM, only to be told that the hostess that we couldn't be seated until 8 15 due to the lack of a reservation Disappointed we head back to the car. I decided to check on Rezzy and discovered that there were actually reservations available starting at 7.15 for every 15 minutes. Thereafter, Feeling misled, I returned to the restaurant where the hostess claimed a table had suddenly become available, but I knew that wasn't true because of the amount of reservations available. When we were seated in the back room, I noticed three unoccupied tables. Clearly I hadn't been told the truth.
Speaker 1:Once seated, my husband asked to substitute chicken for veal in the dish, offering to pay the same price, but the kitchen refused. We opted for $80 dry-aged ribeye instead. Unfortunately, the steak was a major disappointment. The exterior was tough and it hadn't been trimmed properly, and the steak lacked tenderness, making it far from worth the price. I ordered the Wagyu meatball and the gnocchi from the special menu. The flavors were good, but the sauce was overly greasy, with a pool of oil surrounding my plate, let's see. Dessert was all right. It was the highlight. I recommend it Okay. Overall, while the ambiance was pleasant, the food fell short of expectations and the steak in particular felt like a waste of money.
Speaker 1:All right Now I'm going to have to say this You're absolutely right, ziana, zaina, what do you call it, zaina? What does that say, right there?
Speaker 2:Zaina.
Speaker 1:You're absolutely right. We absolutely lied to you. That really happened. We absolutely lied to you. We did not want you to come in here. We don't want customers we manipulate Rezi to lie and we tell everybody they cannot come in. That is why I have won the best chef award in 2024. Our restaurant that we produce the best fucking food. We won every fucking award possible in the state of Virginia locally. That's why because we lie to you we don't let no one in here. It's all a joke. So you're right. You're absolutely right. You nailed that one.
Speaker 2:Yeah, genius, okay, okay.
Speaker 1:So this whole thing about you being a New Yorker- Let Andrea take that.
Speaker 4:You know and and I hate when fucking people say that, because it makes that's like two percent of the people that left new york because of that mentality that they go other places and they flash it like it's a badge. Like I'm from new york, I'm expert on fucking everything, including italian food, just just for starters. Second, being from new york doesn't make you an expert on fucking italian food, especially with a non-italian name. First of all, first.
Speaker 1:So so here's, here's my take on it. Bro, I don't give a shit if you're from new york, new jersey or anything. Yeah, if a guy came here from fucking rome and said this food is not right now I'm going to listen to you. I don't cook New Yorkan food. I cook Italian food. We cook Italian culture. I don't cook. There's no New York food. Yeah, what is New York food? I understand people say I'm from New York.
Speaker 5:Some people think that New York is Italy.
Speaker 1:I know, bro, they tell me this. Oh, they tell me this.
Speaker 5:Oh, I'm from New York.
Speaker 1:Tell the chef I'm from New York. Hopefully this is good. Trust me, I'm from New York.
Speaker 3:I don't give a shit. What the fuck does that mean? I'm from New York, okay.
Speaker 1:You're from New York. What does that mean, bro? You know how many shitty restaurants are in New York.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there's a lot of shitty restaurants.
Speaker 1:Do they even have a health department in New Yorkers? But the second you tell me you're from New York, I'm going to tell you right away I don't give a shit where you're from. Yeah, it doesn't matter, you could be from fucking Cincinnati. What does that mean? I know, Okay, I'm not cooking New York food, All right so let's break down.
Speaker 2:We're going to let the sauce, like the saucier side, go.
Speaker 1:Yeah, okay, let's see. So the sauce.
Speaker 3:I'm sorry. I guess they don't like olive oil. I don't know what to tell you really, but really.
Speaker 1:was there a pool of oil in this? What pool of?
Speaker 3:fuck was that? We got a standard.
Speaker 1:What pool of oil is she talking about? I don't think she understands what she's talking about.
Speaker 3:I don't know what she's talking about.
Speaker 1:So now, if you take a gnoc oil that you don't even understand what you're eating, because I don't understand what pool of oil you're talking about this? Is absolutely ridiculous. These are the type of now, as far as the lies, everything here is reserved out. Every night of the week, every dinner time, we are reserved Everything. If you walk in, customers will walk in and they'll see some tables open. You walked in at 6.15, those tables are going to be here at 6.45. Again, I've said this a million times.
Speaker 2:You can't sit out and eat 30 minutes.
Speaker 1:Right, it's waiting for the reservation. It's not that we don't want you, we're just kind of snickering a little bit that you thought you can get into the best place in town with no reservation and then you're mad at us. Okay, we welcome walk-ins, we welcome everybody stuck up. I'm only talking to this level because I'm combating their level of ignorance when they put a post like this online when my staff is the reason we are who we are. Okay, I can't do it by myself. There's no way it would happen, right? So the whole team suffers. When somebody says this, it's not just me, this just hurts my ego a little bit because it's, it's bullshit. Um, the dry age steak. Learn how to eat a dry-aged steak.
Speaker 2:Right away, learn how to eat a dry-aged steak.
Speaker 1:When you have something that's been sitting on a rack for 44 fucking days, the whole point of it is to draw out the moisture, let the muscle fibers loosen on its own, naturally, and then it breaks down and becomes tender in its own way because of the breakdown of elasticity in the muscle fiber. There's a lot of science to it and you have to know what it is you're eating. A lot of people think it stinks. It does. It has a funk on it. It's been sitting there A lot of the times. The outside is drier and a little bit more chunky than the middle, because it doesn't dry from the motherfucking inside out. It drives from the outside in. So you trim it as much as you can, but that is part of the experience of eating it and people don't understand that.
Speaker 1:So when they take the first little bite of the first piece and it's a little bit dry it's not, the title is dry age it might be a little dry in the first bite, Get into the middle of it and you're going to die. You don't send it back after the first. You know you got to cut it down the middle and enjoy the process that took place. We know what we do. We don't dry age sides of prime beef at hundreds and hundreds of dollars to do it wrong. You know what I mean. We don't serve it for $80. So Zayana can tell us we don't know what we're doing when we have people who are experienced in eating as a profession or as a such a talent or a hobby that it becomes their life, telling us it's the best one they've ever had. Yeah, so am I going to listen to Olive Oil Girl or the fucking ones that come in here?
Speaker 2:I think you should let them. They can close it out and tell people what they really think.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think so. Let me just make sure I'm not missing anything on this chick.
Speaker 2:I don't think she deserves any more time than this. Yeah, you're right. That's why we work good together.
Speaker 1:She'll stop me in this freaking crate.
Speaker 2:He'll get into this for a while.
Speaker 1:Say something about this fucking thing. Go ahead and curse out.
Speaker 2:You know what?
Speaker 4:Fuck you. That's it.
Speaker 5:Fuck you. That's it.
Speaker 3:Couldn't have said it better, go fuck yourself. Just got, so hot I'm going to book you in there. No, it's okay hey listen, we take pride in what we're doing. You're going to come here first off. You start out from New York. You know what?
Speaker 1:Right away, Right away you're from New York.
Speaker 3:Everything we got here is high quality products and stuff like that.
Speaker 1:Now there are reviews out there that get our attention. None of that was one of them, because I know it's all her opinion and I'm not basing what I do and what we've done on her opinion. Right, exactly, and I'll take it. However, educate yourself before you go online and get tore up on my show, because we have a way to come back and we're going to clap Clap, clap, clap and we're going to clap Clap, clap, clap.
Speaker 1:We're going to clap back at you. So here we are. Anyway, guys, it was great talking to you. We're going to have another show, because you always got to get the bugs out first. Right, you got to get the nervousness out, and then we're going to have a good show. We're going to come back together here in the next season three, yeah, based on the Italian-American traditions, and we'll even maybe do some cooking and some experimenting and shit like that.
Speaker 5:I think the cooking would be fun, it would be, fun.
Speaker 2:Oh, my God, I love it.
Speaker 1:So now we just get warmed up, and now our time is up. But anyhow, listen, I say it every time great having you. Ciao, for now, ciao, ciao.
Speaker 4:Alla prossima Arrivederci.
