A Self-Taught Cook Explains How Food Became The Path To Mental Health And Purpose

World Food Chats....We sat down with Max (who helped get his team to World Food Champ status), a self-taught cook who moved from corporate banking to a community-first kitchen, finding focus, purpose, and mental health through complex, science-driven cooking. Along the way, we talk travel, technique, risk, and why authentic growth beats vanity metrics.

• starting a food page to live in the present
• cooking complex Asian dishes from scratch
• giving away food to neighbors and followers
• balancing corporate work with passion projects
• seeing risk as the path to purpose
• learning technique and the science behind cooking
• travel-informed recipes and regional dishes
• authentic social growth over vanity metrics
• rapid fire: tools, senses, ingredients, fears
• where to find Max and beginner advice

The best part is that the WFC opens its doors to anyone who wants to compete! Home cooks included! So congrats to all the competitors and the ones with the drive to duke it out in the kitchen and have a blast doing it!

Check out Max's page here: https://www.instagram.com/maxwells_meals/

Welcome to the show! Burnt Hands Perspective

Chapters

• 0:00 Meeting Max At WFC
• 1:15 From Corporate Banking To Cooking
• 2:54 Food, Mental Health, And Focus
• 4:44 Feeding Neighbors And Community For Free
• 6:44 Passion, Purpose, And Taking Risks
• 9:29 Favorite Cuisines And Cooking From Scratch
• 11:29 Learning Through Travel And Technique
• 13:49 Chef Title, Mentors, And Kitchen Science
• 16:34 Growing An Authentic Social Presence
• 17:54 Cooking With Alton Brown And Technique Why

Transcript

SPEAKER_01: 0:24

All right.

SPEAKER_00: 0:24

We're back.

SPEAKER_01: 0:25

I know again, once again, Burley's back again. I like saying that because it's not a good one. We need to come up. I'm coming up with a new one.

SPEAKER_00: 0:31

I know. We got a couple of new entrances. So Maxwell McGibbon, we're here at the World Food Championships and met you here, and you had a totally different story because it's a competitive environment. So you have a lot of chefs here that work in restaurants, and you were kind of the opposite for a really good reason in food, and you found passion, but you did help. So tell everybody about yourself a little bit and how you came into this competition too.

SPEAKER_02: 0:51

Yeah, so um once again, Max McGibbon, uh born and raised pretty much South Philly in Delaware, the New Jersey area. Um I I've worked in corporate America for 16 years, and pretty much when the pandemic came around, I started working from home like everyone else, and that really kind of got me in my feelings and trying to understand how I can live in the present for once, because that's something I've always struggled with. So uh, you know, starting the food page and knowing that I've always liked to cook growing up while I ever watches food network channels or any food channel, anything food related. So uh I think it was the right decision to make this uh food channel, Maxwell's Meals, on Instagram, TikTok, starting up on YouTube soon too, as well. But it's really been able to push me into what I call pursuit of the present. You know, it's just something I long to strive for, and cooking is how I do it, and posting my content, feeding my community, families, and uh even my followers and friends. All my food's free. And uh I just love to do it.

SPEAKER_01: 1:48

So so you take it's amazing to me that what you're saying, well, this is not the first time we hear this type of scenario when it comes to people going from corporate America to the you to the to the social media to to cook and find a passion. Because if that's what's making if food is what is making you feel better and put getting yourself out there, if food is bringing you out of what it is that that holds you down, you're not alone. No, I mean you're not alone, they're all there's a huge community and they're called everybody because food I think is important to everybody. Even if you're having a bad day and you eat something that's better, why do you think, why do you think someone on death row gets a last meal? Get the last meal, yeah. At least they get their last meal because food is that important. So at least, hey, you're going out, but at least you get a last meal. So they could offer you anything in the world, they could offer you a cigarette, a prostitute, cocaine, yeah, right? They can offer you anything you want, but they don't. They offer you the last meal.

SPEAKER_00: 2:44

They offer you a thing.

SPEAKER_01: 2:45

And most people don't wince. I mean, most people don't think twice, they want their last meal, right?

SPEAKER_00: 2:49

Yeah, it's important, but you said mental health, and we talked about that. So it's important why you kind of found the passion, because food obviously triggers, you know, serotonin, dopamine, oxytocin response in our brain. And you said, you know, you deal with some of that neurodivergent stuff, so it helps you actually focus.

SPEAKER_02: 3:05

Yeah, and it's wild too, because I'm I'm I'm an introvert, but once I get talking and once I break out of my shell, I can talk forever. I could talk about anything, I can get along with everyone.

SPEAKER_01: 3:14

And it's food that subject that brings you right.

SPEAKER_02: 3:18

Nice.

SPEAKER_01: 3:19

So you have your you're you're starting your Instagram or your social media, right? So you're building up your your your army, your brand, and everything else. And and we're we're all there at the same point. Everybody starts somewhere, and some people get to two million and still think they're starting there. So it it's uh it's a never-ending yeah, but the best part about it is if that if that is what's making you feel better and go for the food. You said something very important that I want to make sure I repeat it here, is that he takes his food that you do and you make enough of it during your social media recordings or whatever it may be, and and you give it to people meaning to feed the community.

SPEAKER_02: 3:52

Yeah. And and so that's that's another thing about it. Is like I work in corporate America, I have a career, I have money to supplement all of the what is your corporate job? Uh so I work in a bank. Uh I'm pretty much been there, like I said, 16 years, started from the bottom. Now I'm just managing a call site. I'm here, you know, and now I'm here, you know. And and so this, like I like you said, I live alone. I cook as if I have a family at 10, and anything that I have left over goes to whoever wants it. First come, first serve. Whether it's just a random follower or something.

SPEAKER_01: 4:22

So you have people you have people in your outside in your neighborhood or something?

SPEAKER_02: 4:27

So right now I'm here. So my neighbors are taking care of my dogs. So they know they can once they go take care of my dogs. I have three freezers with a bunch of leftover soups, stews, chicken, bindaloo, anything you can think of. They know they're free to that. They're gonna get cookies when I get back, probably, you know, or whatever they want.

SPEAKER_01: 4:44

So you're gonna make it and then give it to the channel.

SPEAKER_02: 4:46

They love you. Yeah, you're a great neighbor. It's like it's a win-win situation because one, it got me to break me out of my shell, learn to live in the present, find my passion. But also, it's been able to open up opportunities like this, few festivals I've been able to do. I cater weddings or anything that anyone wants to do. So, like, I say my food is free. It's what it's when I cook for my content, it's free. When you want to come over to my house and just shoot the shit, it's free. But if you hit me up and say, hey, I have an 80-person wedding, I'm not gonna say no, but guess what? I'm doing it on my time, right? So, like, just ask me ahead of time. I'm more than willing to help you out. You know, and it's it's all love.

SPEAKER_01: 5:22

So at some point in time, you would, I would, I would imagine you'd like to turn this into some sort of career, not for the money, but to be able to fund your passion.

SPEAKER_02: 5:29

Exactly. And and and so two years ago, if you told me I was losing my job, I'd be shitting my pants, right? Because like I kind of, once I found my passion, I kind of understood that all right, I found something that kind of got me a living in the president for once. Now, how can I kind of keep that? I have I have the job, my career that's making the money for everything, so why not just let me do this for fun because it makes me feel good? You know, and that was two years ago, and I was like, my my whole reasoning behind that is like I don't want to start anything because I don't want to lose that passion. Yeah. I always say, how many, how many times have you worked 13 hour days and gone home and cooked five hours to like a great meal? You're eating top ramen, PB and J or some leftover lemon from the night before. You know, so I finally enjoy that, but now, now if you told me I'm losing my job, I'd be like, that's a blessing, you know, because now I'm talking about my my being in the present, but now I've and my passion, but now there's a purpose in my life now that I'm getting older, and I'm like, all right, well, how can I make this more purposeful? So once that purpose and uh passion balance out, I think that's when I'm gonna have to break free and kind of do what I need to do.

SPEAKER_01: 6:34

You're gonna have to, you're gonna have to, anytime we're in the culinary world, anytime we're dealing with the food industry, and anytime we're doing um uh hospitality industry, yeah, the only way to succeed in it honestly is to s is to sacrifice and risk and take the chance. Because if not, you're not going to ever get out of where you are. And that goes for everybody in industry, okay? If you're a line cook and you're and you're not gonna take the step to become the next level, right? No matter what you're doing, if you're afraid to make your own pasta because you don't have time, you'd rather go drink, that's where you're always gonna be. You have to give up something for something in the industry, no matter what. And if it's not cooking, it's bartending. If it's not bartending, it's weight staff. You know, if you're gonna if you're gonna walk around with a tray of ice water and that's where you're comfortable, or do you want to walk around and get your wine some type certificates? It depends on where you want to be, but you're not gonna get to the next level until you leave that bubble. So losing your job, you like you said, would be a blessing if that passion is there, it'll open up the gate to be able to do it, you know. So um I like it. Talking about food gets me juicy. I know, you get excited.

SPEAKER_00: 7:38

I know someone's hungry right now. So I'm sorry. So we haven't eaten yet today, so we're hungry. So we need to go outside.

SPEAKER_02: 7:44

Right?

SPEAKER_00: 7:44

But what like some of your favorite things to make?

SPEAKER_02: 7:46

So you learned you're more self-taught, so you know, I mean, that's honestly an impossible question for me because I try not to make the not not try to make the same thing twice because I can make chicken parms too. If I wanted to, you know, I love it. But like I have ramen tattooed on my arm, Asian cuisine, anything with complex flavors, Indian food, Thai food, uh, Vietnamese food, like anything, those are probably my favorite things to cook because there's a lot of complexity and steps to the dish. I do everything from scratch. So if I'm doing like jerk chicken, there's 27 spices I'm throwing in my grinder, making a paste, letting it marinate for however long. You know, it's just a step-by-step process, and that's what gets me focused and what helps me live out my price. Yeah, so you're staying on track with everything. I just kind of like forget everything once I'm in the kitchen. But Asian food is probably my favorite.

SPEAKER_00: 8:36

And you traveled, so you said travel is a big part of it. So you're actually going to these countries. Are you learning while you're there and bringing it back? Of course.

SPEAKER_02: 8:43

Uh I I mean bring stuff back if I need to, but I want to be there for the experience. So the most recent place I was I was just in Italy for two weeks, a few months ago, uh, traveling all over from Middle Italy, Rome, all the way up to Lake Cuomo, and just understanding how each region has their own specific dish that's for that region where it was originally from. And just I wanted to go to each city and have that dish. And then when I come back, I want to make that dish.

SPEAKER_01: 9:08

Sure. So I do that often. I go twice a year, but I'm an Italian chef, and if you come down to Virginia Beach and see what I got going on, we can work together on that. But I see you you you went from you don't have any training, you don't you've never worked in the restaurant industry. This is all self-taught stuff. Yes. And you've and he's never um never been in the industry at all. So to be able to do that, yeah, now you're working with a really good chef. So we have a uh chef Chris Williams. We talked to him yesterday, as a matter of fact. So that that episode will pop up here and there. But you're I saw you shoffing for him at the World Food Championship competition. So passion is what brings you there. So whatever level you're at, you're gaining it, and you're gonna continue to gain it by feeding your dragon. You know what I mean? You gotta feed the beast, right? Yeah, always. And each time you do something like this, you're gaining more and more experience. Are you ever gonna work in a restaurant? Maybe not. Are you gonna continue doing what you're doing? Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02: 10:02

Never stop.

SPEAKER_01: 10:03

So maybe the restaurant working in that field just you didn't have to do that because you're a passionate cook. Yeah, right? Whether you're a chef or not is irrelevant. It doesn't matter because you know, the word chef is is so good. It goes all over the place.

SPEAKER_02: 10:18

Like, oh, you're a chef, and I'm like, no, don't get it twisted. Now, like now, I have Alton Brown calling me chef, and now once I was doing events with like some celebrity chef. But now, like, I feel like I I gain the value. Like, I can call myself a chef. I'm not like working out, I'm not an actual chef, but hell, I'll cook the hell out of anything you want me to cook, and it's be one of the best things you've ever tasted. Yeah, so you know, I which is awesome. I it it's it's tough to have that conversation because they're like, oh, what you doing? Then it's like, are you a chef or you're not a chef? And we're talking for 20 minutes about something I don't want to talk about. I just like to cook that damn.

SPEAKER_00: 10:50

Shut up and let me cook. Shut up and let me cook.

SPEAKER_01: 10:53

And and that's amazing. So Alton Brown, talking about Alton Brown. Anyone asks me, I have a couple of celebrity chefs that I I like, but Alton Brown has to be the number one because I still utilize from when I was young and he was on his TV show, I was younger. I was I'm still using some of the methods I learned from him. One of them being the Thanksgiving turkey episode that he had, I still use that after years, after decades of using or or learning in my field. You know, I'm not a slack chef, I'm around some serious chefs, and we cook together at very high levels. So there's a million ways that I've learned to cook a turkey, but I still utilize his because it's so simple and beautiful, and the way it comes out is very scientifically thought out. And it just comes together.

SPEAKER_02: 11:38

Because watching him do what he does in person, that's exactly what it is. Like, it's not just for the episode. But he he he wants everyone to know the why and the how behind everything, and not just say, hey, here's a recipe A through Z, follow the steps and get it done. I tell people all the time, like, it's different giving me a recipe as someone who's not used to cooking, handling a recipe, because it's all about like why. Like, what's the point of like browning the beef before adding some vegetables and building the flavors that you do? How do you build a roux? What does that do? That's the most important technique in the book. Alton Brown, thank you for teaching me that. Right?

SPEAKER_01: 12:10

Yeah, well, yeah, right. That's something we learned all the way. Alton Brown learned that from somebody because that is the fundamental basics of what it is. Yeah when you use a roux versus slurry, stuff like that. There's there's different things, of course. But these are all things that are that's the science behind cooking. And it's a basic science at the roux level. Yeah, but the science grows deep, man. Once we get into the agars and the uh thickening agents and what you know. Sure, there's so many different things we could talk about, but you know, arrowroot, stuff like that, things that people don't understand what the science of it does to certain chemicals in the food. So the chemistry is huge in cooking, just as much as the flavor and the scent and everything else. So having that knowledge is awesome. So you're trying to build your social media empire, and we all know it's not easy because there are so many people doing it, right? Yeah, the options are out there. Yeah, so the algorithms, the luck being here, being there, it will work.

SPEAKER_02: 13:01

Yes, it will work.

SPEAKER_01: 13:02

It will work. And if your content is sincere, it'll it'll last just as long as you put it out there. Yeah, and eventually it's gonna build and grow.

SPEAKER_02: 13:09

Yeah, it does.

SPEAKER_00: 13:10

And it that's what we always hope. So it's it's a game.

SPEAKER_02: 13:13

It's been weird for me because I started obviously well, everyone's zero followers. I'm posting pictures at first four years ago. Like I started with pictures, I moved the time-lapse videos because you guys know, like, you hit a plateau and then you need to switch it up, change it up, do it again. Now I'm doing like full face-on instructional videos, and and uh yeah, it it's tough to do it, but I want the most organic following possible. That's natural. Well, that's what makes a difference.

SPEAKER_00: 13:37

I mean, micro influencers beat out mega influencers any day.

SPEAKER_02: 13:41

Once you start getting in this business or doing this content stuff, you'll you'll get a lot of DMs like do this, like ten dollars, you can raise your followers. Like, it's all BS because then you what do you want? 8,000 followers, just so people could see you have two likes. Like, it's it shows.

SPEAKER_00: 13:55

I can go on someone's account and tell them they've paid for followers. So we have clients that have been in that situation, and it's it's it doesn't get you anywhere. It's but we call it vanity metrics. You don't need the vanity metrics.

SPEAKER_01: 14:06

We're not doing it for that because it's useless. We're doing it to put the message out. Yeah, we're talking to the restaurant industry, we're talking to the restaurant people who like the restaurant industry as a whole. Foodies. And if you're a robot, you don't eat, so we don't give a shit about what the hell you fucking like about. We don't care about that.

SPEAKER_00: 14:22

Yeah, we don't like those kind of farms. We're regular farms, not the same.

SPEAKER_01: 14:28

So pot farm to assume.

SPEAKER_00: 14:30

So I have we have to do the, we have some at the like towards the end of these, we like to do these little rapid fire questions. So I'm gonna get a couple that are appropriate for you, because again, you're not in the regular kitchen brigade. So these are gonna be like quick answers, so we gotta we gotta go through them just to see how you're gonna do it. First thing that comes to mind. All right. So besides a knife, what is your go-to kitchen tool you can't live without?

SPEAKER_02: 14:51

Tweezers.

SPEAKER_00: 14:53

You're the first person to say tweezers. The long okay. I love my tweezers.

SPEAKER_01: 14:57

I use tweezers, I have 12, 18 inch, 14 inch. My pasta, it's my second year.

SPEAKER_00: 15:03

That's not it. All right. What puts you in the mood more? Smell or the visual?

SPEAKER_02: 15:08

Smell.

SPEAKER_00: 15:09

Okay. The favorite ingredient you can't live without.

SPEAKER_02: 15:15

Potatoes, I don't think. I like that.

SPEAKER_00: 15:18

Um, what cooking method intimidates you the most?

SPEAKER_02: 15:22

Oh shit. Um could be French, could be English, could be uh just like sous vide, could be sauces sometimes, maybe. Sauces. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 15:32

Sauces are hard to get, but you gotta learn that. That's a that's a process.

SPEAKER_00: 15:35

Your favorite cheap fast food restaurant?

SPEAKER_02: 15:38

Oh, Burger King. Just a Whopper Man, just like hot whopper. And also it's it's a half mile from a house, too, like a walk there.

SPEAKER_00: 15:47

I like it. Okay. Um if your kitchen was a car, what kind of car would it be?

SPEAKER_02: 15:52

Oh, um uh a V dub van. Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 15:56

I like that one. Like the ones from the 70s.

SPEAKER_02: 15:59

Throw a surfboard on top, I don't even surf fucking. Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_00: 16:02

Just for the aesthetics. Okay. Baking, yes or no?

SPEAKER_02: 16:05

Baking?

SPEAKER_00: 16:06

Baking.

SPEAKER_02: 16:07

No, two years ago, yes now.

unknown: 16:09

Okay.

SPEAKER_02: 16:10

I hate flour, it gets everywhere. All right.

SPEAKER_00: 16:12

All right, and if you could cook with anyone, who would it be?

SPEAKER_02: 16:15

Um you've kind of already done it. I already didn't know. And it's just like I'm sorry, Anthony Bourdain. That's what we're sure.

SPEAKER_03: 16:23

Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 16:23

So there you go. All right, awesome. Well, let's tell everybody where to find you so they can follow along.

SPEAKER_02: 16:28

Yeah, so uh it's Maxwell's underscore meals. It's on Instagram, TikTok. I do have some YouTube stuff out now, but I focus on Instagram and TikTok. And uh, and yeah, that's exactly where you can find me. I'm in Delaware. If you're ever around and want any free food, if you want free food, just show them in his house. If you want to do a night in Philly, we can do that too. I'll be I necessarily. Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_01: 16:47

If you had one thing to say to anybody that's coming up under the, you know, anyone who's trying to influence or anyone who's trying to learn how to cook but doesn't, you know, feels the intimidation of not being in a kitchen. What do you what do you got to say to that?

SPEAKER_02: 16:59

What's what you I have to say, anything is possible, just try it out, and whatever doesn't work, try something different, you know? And it's just like like you said, you gotta break out of that that that mold a little bit. And like, I I was scared to cook once too, but like I found to do it. And even if it's not your thing, just try it out. It brings people together, even if you can have bring people into the kitchen with you to help you out so you all can learn, just do it.

SPEAKER_01: 17:22

And feed a matter. From going from scared to cook once to cooking with Ultra Brown without having any restaurant in the middle, is is something to be said. Yeah. So follow this guy. Congratulations. Follow this guy.

SPEAKER_00: 17:34

Thank you for being here with us. We appreciate it.

SPEAKER_01: 17:36

Appreciate you. Have a great day, man. Enjoy this fucking World Food Championship. No, I know. Again, live and direct, WFC working. There we are. And uh ciao for now.

SPEAKER_00: 17:47

Ciao for now.

SPEAKER_01: 17:47

Thank you, guys.